I think if I was Langmuir, I would offer to send Casy a complete new control box to see if that helps.
everything new all the guts with the USB not touching the box. I know they monitor this thread, so maybe they will agree to do so.
I am not much help, hell I don’t even have a plasma cutter or table yet but plan on buying one once I retire (in the next ten months or so) but I do have some CNC experience with home built 3d printing and had the same sort of issues Casey talks about with those, crashing all the time. They were connected to a computer via CNC. Once I went to a small 4x32 screen and sd card connected to the control board and NO USB… all my problems went away.
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I was suggesting downgrading to win10 to use firecontrol 20.6.2 or 20.5.
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I’d settle for a new board, even though my hands are so big they barely fit in their to replace it. 
The USB seems to be the route of all problems for everyone, to some degree; whether directly or indirectly. The arc droid uses a system similar to what you describe, but it seems to be a much less capable machine, overall. Not to mention WAY smaller.
I know. But that OS does use less system resources, and current FireControl software doesn’t seem “optimized” for 11.
Ok, not the update y’all wanted, but this is the update you’re gonna get.
The USB grounding issues was something that was lost in translation.
@ChelanJim, if you’re having freezing issues, your measured 3k-ish ohms may actually be the problem.
Langmuir wants to see 10k ohms minimum, and no conductivity is ideal. Though they haven’t had many reported problems above 3-4kOhms.
So, yeah, yeah, yeah, you guys were right, @Bigdaddy2166, @TinWhisperer, and whoever else said it.
Moving on.
@ttoy360 is onto something, too. The FireControl system requirements are not based on a Windows 11 installation. 4gb of ram probably isn’t going to cut it on a Windows 11 machine.
And, fun fact, the ASUS Vivobook is NOT upgradable. It has a DDR4 stick soldered into its only slot. If anybody wants to solder an 8gb DDR4 stick into my motherboard for me, please let me know.
Langmuir still thinks the laptop is not “likely” my issue, but I feel dumb for defending it so fiercely, even though, let’s face it, it’s a little bit silly to list minimum reqs for a Windows based system that are out of line with the current OS.
Anyway, most indicators still point to EMI. A USB isolator is recommended. I may get a new laptop as well.
Thomas @ Langmuir found the instantaneous freezing in the same manner as I have been experiencing from connecting the plasma work leads together pretty interesting, because it was so repeatable.
Definitely points to EMI.
We may send a video to the Langmuir software guy.
Interesting to think Langmuir expects me to have problems. I have never had any “freezing.” The only issues I have had have been with the limit switches or when my torch delay is less than .63 seconds. And perhaps a dozen instances of “should-have-known-better” and stupidity. The issues with the torch delay and limit switches are always prompted with an error/warning from FireShare. Perhaps my Hypertherm unit is compensating for the 3.5k ohms in other ways.
I will admit I am doing many things that I have read that I should not do:
- I have a 3 conductor extension cord that powers the electronics.
- My laptop is plugged in almost every time I use my table.
- I have a 16 foot long USB printer cable from the laptop to the electronics box.
- I have cables that cross and touch but the USB never crosses the work lead or torch cable.
Perhaps I should take the reading with a 3-to-2 prong converter /adapter plug and see what the reading would be.
But happy to report: my set up is working fine. I wish I could drive over and set up the Hypertherm on your table and see what happens. We could cut up some road signs… 
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I wouldn’t say that they “expect” you to have problems, but if you were, that USB ground is something that would likely be addressed. I’m going to say that you’re one of the lucky ones, but you also bought a Hypertherm. It seems like they are very well shielded, and Primeweld’s are not. If you had purchased a Primeweld, you’d probably be having problems. Which is not to say that Primeweld’s can’t work with proper setup…and maybe a bit of luck.
@TinWhisperer hit the nail on the head ~120 posts ago. There’s nothing wrong with a Primeweld Cut60 if EVERYthing else is right with your setup. But that Primeweld machine sure seems to find every possible weakness.
All you smart folks in this forum better look out!
I’m learning a lot! 
But don’t you wish you didn’t have to learn every day!
One of my all time favorite phrases of wisdom comes to mind: “The struggles we survive, we grow from.” (I have probably messed up the actual phrase but you get the point.)
I think it is time for you to put your dogs up and have a refreshment. Tomorrow is another day.
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My laptop offer still stands.
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I figured it would and I appreciate it immensely. I just bit the bullet and bought a Dell with a 4ghz i5 and 8gb ram. Best Buy had it on sale $200 less than I could find it anywhere else, and I think I can probably sell my like new ASUS for $200, so it will only be a $200 hit at the end of the day.
It’s probably a dumb move, because I don’t think it will solve my issue, but at least I won’t be right up against the system limits, and it will eliminate another variable.
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. Doesn’t hurt
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Passing this along in case you can glean anything from my scenario. I did a little trial on my system yesterday. Over the past few days, I’ve successfully cut 5 signs w/FCtrl 21.1 and FCtrl froze during two of the cuts. However, the g-Code program continued to progress fine and FCtrl became active again after the program completed.
Snapped a few pics. This first one is with cut in progress, but before FCtrl froze. You can see FCtrl + background programs using about 22% of resources and a little over half processor speed…
This data is while cutting, but FCtrl completely frozen. No screen updates to anything and even the cursor will not respond.
About 10 seconds or so after completing the cut, FCtrl again responds.
I figured it would and I appreciate it immensely. I just bit the bullet and bought a Dell with a 4ghz i5 and 8gb ram. Best Buy had it on sale $200 less than I could find it anywhere else, and I think I can probably sell my like new ASUS for $200, so it will only be a $200 hit at the end of the day.
It’s probably a dumb move, because I don’t think it will solve my issue, but at least I won’t be right up against the system limits, and it will eliminate another variable.
Dell Lattitude Core I5
Here are my systems specs:
Even though this was not with “Compatability” version, I get the same freezing running it. I do think the air drying and EMI (10 cable chokes, cable separation, moved cutter out from under table) changes I’ve made have helped. My electrode and tips are wearing much better and previously my torch was freezing up or refusing to fire on some portions of a cut, but continuing on with the program. Everything seems fine now except for the screen refresh/frozen controls. Still unacceptable, but better.
Anyway, maybe some piece of your puzzle in there…
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Interesting.
Remind me, you’re working with a Cut60, but it’s an older one (pre-compatibility change), wired raw voltage, and you had, but now fixed the usb/case contact, right?
Your system specs are now identical to mine, except you’re on Windows 10, which uses even less of your system resources.
My FireControl very rarely unfreezes without having to restart it. And it’s interesting that you have had the same freezing with the compatibility version, as that is one of the things Langmuir wanted me to try as a test.
You’ve got some good data there. What does the fact that FireControl recovers indicate? That’s the question…
Have you done a service ticket with Langmuir yet? I think they would be interested in knowing about your documented freezing case, as well as my own, and Austin’s.
My last conversation with them ended with direction to eliminate the computer variable, and then try to document the freezing so that it could be sent to the programmer. It kind of felt like they’re thinking it could be a software issue. The Langmuir electronics are decently shielded, and the motion control board is designed to minimize the effects of EMI; with someone who has taken reasonable attempts to minimize EMI, it should not be still be significant enough to freeze FireControl, even with a particularly noisy plasma cutter.
I’m doing some tests with the new computer today…
Everything you remembered on my system is correct. My Cut60 is 3yrs old with the CNC port in the bottom right corner. Wired raw from day 1 in Sept 2022.
Yes, I had USB contact and fixed it. I get no continuity between the USB and the slats or any part of the table. My case (edit: painted surfaces) shows no continuity, but the screws holding the case on do show continuity.
As for unfreezing, previous to the other things I improved, mine would also freeze, torch firing, and FCtrl would refuse to let me stop the program or anything. Had to shutdown torch and control box.
Hard knock on wood, the air drying, USB fix, Cable chokes/better wire separations, and cutter relocation SEEM to have gotten me to the point as described above. Also not seeing the arcing inside my tip like I had before.
I am heading out to try two more signs here soon. I am down from 10 to BH pucker factor 7. 
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That’s worth more than gold right there…
Alright, so who here had their money on LAPTOP as the cause of my FireControl freezing!?
…
…
…
Because you owe me a beer!
New Dell i5 4.2ghz, 8gb RAM, OpenGL 4.6, etc, etc. Didn’t make one bit of difference to how FireControl freezes.
Oh well…on to the next thing.
Langmuir is sending me a USB isolator to try. That could be interesting.
@Wsidr1 and I seem to be having the EXACT same behavior from FireControl v21.1, which is very interesting because between us we have tried every suggestion in this forum, with the exception of ditching the Primeweld plasma cutter altogether…
Have you tried v20.6 yet, Bret? Since you’re on Windows 10 you could certainly try it…
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Alright guys, I think it’s time to try raw voltage wiring. I know that several of you have wanted me to try raw voltage for a while, but I think I finally have an indication that the voltage divider is doing something strange.
After the new laptop test revealed that my computer was never the issue, I tried something @Bigdaddy2166 had recommended a while back; using a ground plug isolator on the Langmuir electronics enclosure.
I had three normal cuts, and in the middle of the fourth cut live voltage spiked to 282.7v and froze there.
This represents two FIRSTS
This is the first time I have had a voltage spike; I have never seen a voltage while cutting above ~125v.
This is the first time I have had ONLY Live Voltage freeze without the torch speed and THC DRO’s also freezing.
Am I correct in thinking that this spike could be a representation (manifestation?) of exactly what has been going wrong with the Primeweld CNC port on these machines all along?
*** UPDATE ***
I asked Gene at Primeweld this question and this was his response:
“Casey actually it was EFI from internal cable routing and lack of insulation, this was all corrected in the second generation model.
Going direct to raw voltage points would take out all other instances of EFI or voltage issues.”
This certainly seems like another mark on the Primeweld Cut60’s record for CNC plasma applications.
@mechanic416, do you have any thoughts on this voltage spike and what it means?
I also want to add that today I had 3 unrecoverable freezes in a total of 2 minutes and 12 seconds total cutting time.
The only thing I changed, was switching from a laptop that barely met the minimum system requirements to one that is roughly double the minimum system requirements, and the ground plug isolator on the last couple of cuts.
This tells me that the 1-1/2 hours I got out of this machine the other day was a total fluke. 
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Hey, so who was it that put together the raw voltage wiring guide for the Cut60? Was that you @nicaDd? Or @72Pony?
I just read through 6 threads on THC issues on couldn’t find it again. I found a picture of a couple of lugs inside the machine, but I thought I had seen a guide that was slightly more detailed.
ALSO
Has anybody actually experienced MORE EMI from moving their plasma cutter further from the table? I’ve seen a couple of posts from Langmuir which somewhat fiercely stated that the torch voltage lead could act like an antenna increasing EMI if extended.
Both times that I have moved my plasma cutter FURTHER away from the table it has seemed to get slightly worse.
I’m currently 9’ from the electronics on a 10’ extension cable, and my FireControl freezing is the worst it has been, with the exception of when I briefly had the torch and work clamp leads connected together.
me
PrimeWeld Raw Voltage Cable Installation.pdf (2.3 MB)
if it’s “freezing” but still cutting then it’s not EMI related. that sounds more like software issues.
if it’s freezing completely where everything stops responding and firecontrol greys out, that’s EMI that’s affecting the USB connection betweem computer and contorl box.
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There it is. Thank you. I’m going to try this next.
Langmuir’s software developer is currently watching some videos I have recorded of the freezing in real time, and Thomas in support has passed on all relevant data about everything we have tried.
FC has frozen consistently this way since day 1; two plasma cutters, three laptops, USB contact fixed, multiple FireControl installations, cable management from horrid to as perfect as you can get it, plasma cutter moved far from electronics, electrical service re-wired, everything on, everything off, etc, etc, and no discernible difference, except for a couple of flukes.
I still have some suggestions from this thread to try (table grounding, faraday cages, etc), and raw voltage, I think are really the only ones left. I guess if I get desperate I can do the Windows 10 back-date, and try FCv20.6, but Langmuir says practically every Pro and XR they have sold in the last year is running FCv21.1 without issue.
Unfortunately, Langmuir’s basically telling me that they can’t fix it, at this point, and I need to try and work around the freezing by baby sitting FC, pausing cuts when it freezes, write down the line number, restart FC, and use the “run from” feature.
As often as it freezes (3 times in less than 132 seconds of torch time) I think I could probably cut things more efficiently by hand.
I’ll try raw voltage and let you guys know if that changes anything.