Creative Table Bases? Multiple Table Frames, Rolling Carts, Storage, Etc?

ARCFLAT Weld Tables
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There’s a new (two days ago) YouTube review on the Primeweld table, and it does look like one of the three tables this guy received is almost as bad as my worst one. But the other two seem a bit better than my good one. It’s a bummer that QC is such a roll of the dice on this kind of stuff. +/- 0.0075” shouldn’t be a hard spec to hit for a modern machine shop. I almost wonder if these things aren’t being machined on some type of sled fixture (like wood guys use with a router to surface slabs). Typically with a milling table, you’d end up with a crown if your setup isn’t rigid enough, versus a dish…

Anyway, here’s that video if anybody’s curious:

A New YouTube Review

My experience with Langmuir QC is that it’s more or less performed by the end user, so I wonder if it’s just as much of a crapshoot as the Primeweld?

I also feel like Langmuir probably has more clout with the Chinese factory making these, so that may translate to them receiving a better product…

Anybody want to go measure your table!?

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I discovered something interesting today. Whether or not the table is leveled makes a huge difference on how flat the surface actually is. Sadly, my pair of tables is still way off even when they’re level, but my good table goes from a 0.020” dish to a 0.040” dish if I put it somewhere on the floor where there’s more weight on those already high corners. Anyway, for those of you that might have your tables on casters with no way of leveling them, it’s something to consider…

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43

So they have adjustable legs? forget about level for a min, can you adjust the legs and get the table flatter?
Those tables are not that big seems odd the legs would effect them that much, seems like the top would be much more stout than that.

Is there any type of cross bracing on the bottom of the table?

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44

Yes they have adjustable feet as standard, and I spent an extra $100 to get adjustable Footmaster casters. And, of course I tried to adjust the legs more to level the table surface; I couldn’t get it there. It seems that they will sag a little on an uneven surface, but I can’t seem to “distort” them any flatter. I was honestly pretty surprised when I discovered it, but it makes sense, because my 10” Southbend lathe is way more stout than this fixture table and if it’s even a little bit out of level, it will start cutting tapers.

Also yes, the back side of the casting is fully webbed, just like the Langmuir table. I guess 0.015-0.020” isn’t that much over 3’, even at this weight.

Anyway, very interesting…

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For those of you who need a laugh on your Saturday afternoon:

Oh, and a PS to @Upstategrowguy77 and anybody else who is a fan of the Fabrication Series; since that video you posted by Justin of the Fabrication Series played a significant role in my own decision to order the Primeweld table, I very respectfully commented on his video to that effect, and said that I was pretty unhappy with what I received, and that I didn’t mean to bash, but that I wanted to provide a counter-point to anybody watching the video and scrolling the comments. AND HE DELETED IT!

Honestly, it kind of blew my mind…

Justin says in the video that he paid for two of the tables with his own money, borrowed one, and received “the other one for free”, for use on his other channel. He also said that his review was completely unbiased. He did not say WHICH table was free, but he did quite obviously crown the Primeweld table the winner of his comparison, and he has allowed comments that are critical of the other thre brands.

Just goes to show you have to be VERY careful of who you trust on YouTube.

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46

wow I’m not a big fan of Justins for say but I was a fan of the primeweld equipment I’ve purchased so far but that table is totally unacceptable, Have you called Primeweld they will answer the phone no matter what day it is and they will refund your money at the very least but I’m sure they will do better than that, I guess we now know why those fireball tables are worth the price tag

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47

Well, notice that I haven’t put them on blast by tagging them in that video, which will get a lot more eyeballs than this post. Not yet, anyway.

So far they have offered me my choice of a $200 courtesy refund (per $900 table), or to exchange the table tops, once I have returned these back to them. I am awaiting clarification on whether or not they are willing to cover the return shipping, which at 150 lbs per, would likely make returning the table cost-prohibitive for me without a commercial shipping account.

Hopefully I’ll know more on Monday.

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For sure, sucks to have to deal with it at all because you purchased a product that is not what its supposed to be so they should be covering everything and making it 100% right. I sure hope they do or it will change my view on them for sure. I’m lucky to only live like 3 hours from them but I still wouldn’t want to deal with making a trip for something that is on them.

Best of luck with it all. hope you get it straightened out

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Was debating pulling the trigger on them or langmuir for a table. Glad I saw your video. Always was a fan of Justin’s YT work, and thought PW was a brand that would put quality first. WMDC has been a go to for me for TIG stuff.

Guess I wait a little longer for a good table…

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I was honestly really surprised that sharing my bad experience was “censored” in the comments on Jeremy’s video. I also got a weird comment over there from somebody telling me to “quit being such a Karen”, which I found a little odd, and kinda felt it might have come from someone associated with the channel, but who knows.

Anyway, for full transparency, PW just yesterday gave me back $200 on my table that had slight cosmetic damage but was very close to their advertised flatness (my choice), and they are going to exchange my really bad table for another one, paying return shipping, etc. There is some concern that they will actually have a table that’s any flatter out of the 5 they have in stock, which tells me that they know they are having some QC issues. They also had to purchase a straightedge to measure the tables they have in stock, but did make a comment about measuring future tables, too…!? The other big issue is that their tables currently ship without any corner protectors in a single layer of cardboard, which I’m assuming is how they are packaged by the Chinese factory; PW says they are “working on this” for some time in the future.

So, my take is that within the next few months you’d probably be able to get something a little better (flatness-wise), delivered to you without damage, from Primeweld. If they can sort these things out, they will have the clear winner in the under $1,000 category. In the meantime, you can roll the dice, and you might (some might say probably will) get a decent table, and even if you don’t, with a fair bit of hassle, Primeweld WILL make it right (they’re good that way), BUT…

If you are buying two or three sections to make a 3’x4’ or 3’x6’ table, then you’re looking at $2,000-$3,000, and for that kind of money you’re awfully close to Fireball Tool’s “The Workbench” fixture table which is 60”x30” and has a 1” thick surface for ~$5,000. After seeing how much these 3/8” thick tables flex when they’re just a bit out of level, it starts to sink in that they’re probably really too thin for any substantial work-holding.

If I had it to do over, I think I would have gone the Fireball route, even though it would have meant waiting until next year.

That’s the full story, near as I can tell it, anyway. I hope it helps you in your decision. I will come back and post a full, and truly unbiased video review once I receive and measure my replacement table, and once I have finished editing the unboxing and setup footage I have filmed so far.

Thank You,

Casey

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51

Your experience says a lot about Prime Weld. This does nothing but help show they are a company that cares about customer service!

Most places would have never went to the trouble of buying a straight edge, now maybe they can get the manufacture to buy one! :rofl:

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Totally agree. That is the part that struck me: They are taking it seriously. And, are willing to admit that they might have an issue if they have to be another layer of quality assurance over the manufacturing.

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53

They would have to know what one was to buy it… but who can blame them, I tried to get google to translate straight edge to Chinese and this is what it spit out.

image

This is apparently the simplified version.
image

So I tried breaking down each character…

image
tree / wood / coffin / wooden / simple / numb / one of the eight ancient musical instruments 八音[ba1 yin1] / surname mu

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large/to speak cautiously

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old (of people) / venerable (person) / experienced / of long standing / always / all the time / of the past / very / outdated / (of meat etc) tough / prefix used before the surname of a person or a numeral indicating the order of birth of the children in a family or to indicate affection or familiarity

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man / person / people

So it could be a large older wooden male too… could explain the curve in @CrazyCasey table top :wink:

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Tree large old man… You know straight edge.

First word of each symbol

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55

One thing I dont want to take away from the Chinese is they have the ability to manufacture good stuff, it all depends on what American companies want to pay for.

Kovosu makes a very nice fixture table and there Chinese. Of course I have never seen one to put a straight edge on it. Plus you have to deal with them in China as there are no dealers in the US that I know of.

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I agree, they make exactly what they are asked to make… I do think that sometimes expectations can be negatively affected by communication issues. I don’t have any personal experience working in/with China. My brother has spent allot of time and has allot of good friends over there, but the people and the government are two different things… I don’t want this to end up in the sandbox and maybe I already took it there… but companies who move their manufacturing to China are giving their technology away… it’s almost part of the agreement.

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57

There has been too many cats in that sandbox also.

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58

One of our friends shared with us about her business venture. It was a very lucrative enterprise doing business in China in the mid 80’s thru the 90’s. They would approach the Chinese manufacturers to make quality, knock-off snowboarding clothing.

I see this as shameful but the story goes on.

She had a switch with business partners and this second partner had unknown motives: shift manufacturing to other factories for a kick-back. The clothing would frequently come with problems: zippers not working, fabrics not matching the colors, etc. This partner continued to steer business to those companies. She said she had to get out of it as there was beginning to be more problems than benefits.

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I hate to say it, but our own need for excess is what has caused this to happen. There is no turning back now, we all want the latest and greatest. All you have to do is look at the amount of storage units in the US storing stuff most people don’t really need

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Mostly what American consumers want to pay. There are companies producing the best quality because their customers want that and will pay for it.

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