What’s your goal with the laser? Marking or cutting alternative materials?
Both. In case folks don’t know, a CO2 laser, though it won’t touch metals at all, is quite excellent at marking anodized aluminum. Essentially, it vaporizes the dye used to color aluminum, thus darker colors provide more contrast and better look (depending on what you’re going for I guess). Lasering black anodized looks absolutely bright white for instance. Then there’s marking/engraving and cutting all the appropriate other materials too.
My intention is to get a cutter powerful enough to cut 1/2" plywood. I have lots of ideas for making shop storage solutions and if I could cut the pieces from <= 1/2" plywood, it would make for relatively simple and easy making them. And fun. So yeah, large enough table for small-ish cabinet parts, i.e. under 24" or so.
Anyways, that’s my thinking. I’ve pondered on a laser before a few times and so far haven’t passed threshold enough to pull the trigger, and still haven’t as of today. I am leaning more towards it than ever before and I’m thinking I’ll probably do it this time… eventually.
I’ve kind of decided rather than invest in a high-quality one, I’ll probably spend 1/5 that amount to get a cheapie chicom one and spend time & money upgrading it as desired. It’s more of a learning/tuition thing at this time and the stuff I make will just be occasional personal things. If it becomes a regular thing or the unlikely event that it generates income, then I’ll re-visit the investment side of it. Hard to know what to do until you know what you want. I don’t mind the certain frustrations of a sub-par budget machine, and rather fully expect them. Like I said, at this point, I consider it more a learning tool than an investment in productivity. The dinking around with upgrades and tweaks will school me up faster on lasers than just purchasing my way through it.
It’s not easy bein’ green.
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You echo many of my thoughts, but until I build a shop I just can’t justify the space for one.
Good luck, the Chicom lasers seem like they’re halfway decent for the money so long as no one drops them in transit. It would be a lot of fun to have the added capability.
You can use a marking spray like Cermark or Laserbond to fuse a coating to other metals kind of like how laser printers fuse toner to paper. I made a stainless steel sign for my son with his patent lasered on with Cermark. The brushed stainless was a great background for the patent (it has to do with AR/MR visualization technology in 3D holographic space) with the whole “future science” type vibe.
It’s incredibly difficult to mark the fused coating once the laser has done its work. I messed up the first attempt and figured I’d just remove it and re-engrave. No chemical I had would strip it and going after it with a wire wheel & a flap disk weren’t real successful either. I finally ended up cutting a new blank in the Crossfire and doing it all over again. 
BTW, you can get CO2 Lasers with fiber heads or fully fiber lasers that will cut metals. But the price tag exceeds my interest 
There’s a good post on the LightBurn forum (How spooked should I be about Ebay machines? - #6 by LightBurn - Community Laser Talk - LightBurn Software Forum) where one of the fairly knowledgeable users talks about brokering a direct purchase with a quality laser mfr in China. If I were to buy a bigger CO2 laser, I’d go that route.
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Beens we went from Kansas to lasers… Any of you know much about Lasers to …Etch may be the word ? Using a laser to say put a picture on to a mirror or a glass surface ? I really have no idea but it looks interesting to do. Thanks in advance or any help , info , sarcasm or abuse.
why yes…I am developing sharks with laserrs so I can take over the world…mwahahahahah…(evil laugh)
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A low power (30W+) CO2 laser will do that. Place a piece of wet paper towel or a film of dish soap on the glass to help keep it from fracturing. The laser really chips the surface (very teeny tiny chips) vs burning like it does wood or plastic.
You can also do the back of a mirror (reverse the image first) and it will engrave the silvering off. The image will show on the front of the mirror.
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I just bought a laser pecker2 so I’ll be toying with this stuff soon!
Any recomendations on an affordable one? Havnt looked around at prices because I have no idea about any of it till you said 30W+ CO2
Depends on what your tolerance for tinkering is. Are you looking for plug & play or are you up to a bit of machine cleanup ?
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Plug and play is nice, but I dont mind assembling if thats what you mean by clean up. Im thinking a budget of 2 k. I like the idea of etching flat glass and cups/glasses to. I just need some guidance to point me in the right direction. I could go a bit higher on the price if need be. I know there like everything else. Entry level up to top of the line . And so many brands to. No idea what is what. Im not even sure 2k will buy a decent hobby one. Like one with maybe a 12x12 bed. And I apriciate any info. Thank you.
I think what jamesdhatch meant is for you to assess how comfortable you would be with doing various upgrades to an initially inexpensive laser.
First, I’d say that you should be able to do a 60w laser with a 16" x 20" bed for around $1600 or so with the cheap imports. That’s not a bad start and should etch glass as well as engrave other things and even cut 1/4" plywood pretty easy (based on what I’ve been learning the past week or so). You can also go smaller and look at the 40w ones for roughly $400 or so and get a rotary attachment (for tumblers & such), but upgrades would soon eclipse the cost of the original machine. A 40W will etch glass (and other stuff) and maybe cut 1/8" plywood with some effort.
The well-crafted expensive ones are easily 5x the cost of the cheap imports. I’ll walk through my thinking and maybe it will help, though this is just my own personal take and you may definitely want a different path, if at all.
I could afford one of the expensive ones if I thought I wanted one. My problem is that I have only barely used one for less than ten minutes so I’m essentially a total beginner to it. Thus I have reservations about throwing so much money at it when I know so little. I could be wrong, but I feel certain that my ignorance would end up breaking expensive things.
I have been building things my whole life and I’m old. I’m a machinist by trade and have already scratch built a couple half-hearted attempts at CNC milling machines that turned out pretty OK I guess. Therefore, the thought of getting a cheap laser and doing various upgrades as I go, based on which things turn out to bother me the most being at the top of the list, seems like no big deal to me at all. You just pick one at a time and work it through. Honestly though, you don’t need my kind of background to do a good job on the kinds of upgrades you might want to do for a laser. There are lots of write-ups and youtube videos showing how to do most any of them (lots of folks in the same boat over the years).
I chose an 80w machine with 28" x 20" bed because that’s the largest one I can still get through a 36" doorway into my basement, and I eventually want to cut thicker wood thus the higher power. For me, the larger machine feels more worth getting with the intention of doing upgrades in mind. I could basically go all-out and by the time I’m done still possibly won’t have doubled the cost of the original machine, and that’s even if I go that far with it. But at first, I’m going to just use it with the original overrated tube, cheap power supply, marginal optics, a water bucket with ice cubes for cooling, manual focus and noisy exhaust. All of that can be upgraded, but all of it will work OK for quite some time as well. I did opt to purchase a machine with a control that’s already compatible with good software I plan to use. The only immediate DIY upgrade I’m planning before I even try it out is a 0-30mA ammeter so I don’t overdrive the tube. That’s under $10.
Anyways, that’s a verbose way of outlining my own approach and also saying that I think jamesdhatch was referring to is tinkering with upgrades & tweaks on a cheap import laser because there are many you can do, while the nice pricey ones can be genuinely fully appointed to work really well out of the box for a very long time… “for a small fee”. If some poking, prodding and tinkering won’t bother you, then you can save some $$ and learn a lot. If you don’t have the appetite for it, the pricey ones do appear to be a pleasure.
A good start for shopping around is, of course eBay. Search " 40w co2 laser " and " 60w co2 laser " to see what is out there. I’d narrow the search to US only just for good measure. But get on the intertubes and search " K40 laser " and you’ll see what people have been doing with them (“K40 whisperer” in particular for drastically improved software/control upgrade)
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I agree with just about everything you said. Only caveat is you should be able to easily cut 1/8" ply with a 40W laser. Qtr inch might require 2 passes but I routinely cut it with a 45W.
Two things are critical there though - the first is the material. Most plywood is crap for lasers. Odd internal stuff like voids, glues and even Bondo. Go with Baltic Birch (not Birch, Baltic Birch). I get mine off Amazon for small sheets in quantity or my local Woodcraft or Ruggs stores. The stuff in the big boxes is not Baltic Birch. BB is manufactured to a very controlled standard as it’s used a lot in cabinet making. If you’re getting a 4x8 sheet it’s probably not BB as it’s sold in 5ft widths. (There are some exceptions but you’re not likely to come across them.)
The other thing that’s critical is the rated power of your laser tube. They’re almost all sold based on the max power output. The trouble is that laser tubes have a very flat profile in terms of lifespan until you run it about 95% of rated power and then the lifespan drops off a cliff. My first 40W laser actually had a 32W output at recommended amps. A quality tube will have both rated (long use consistent) power and the max listed. If it’s only got one value listed, it’s most likely the max and you should consider the real output to be about 20-25% less unless you like replacing tubes. Your addition of an ammeter is a great idea.
A “K40” will be cheap ($400) but can use a bunch of upgrades. The electrics are suspect (it’s not uncommon for the ground wire inside the machine not to be connected to the grounding pin of the power cord receptacle), there are generally no safety interlocks so you can certainly burn your hand (or worse) with an invisible beam of light (don’t ask me how I know 
) and as you noted the software is also usually junk. But there are a couple of good open source or community supported alternatives like Whisperer (I was a K40 owner and helped throw some beer money dollars to help dev).
Jim’s 2K will get him a decent machine that’s safe to use and a bit of extras like potentially a moveable bed and rotary attachment. He can also get more power (for faster work). Definitely a 60W is in the cards (my Redsail was originally a 60W) and can usually be upgraded to an 80 or 100 with the first tube replacement. Just need to make sure the power supply is good and get a tube housing extension to accommodate the extra length. Should be able to get a decent sized bed as well.
I’m a big proponent of buying as big & powerful as you can afford (never heard anyone complain their tools had too much power). For folks here, the “will I find a use for it” shouldn’t be an issue.
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Yeah, if it was 40w I would not have sounded hesitant. The K40 stock tube is so overrated though so I was referring to those being able to cut it well. Since it’s more like 30w or less is what I was thinking. Of course I have almost zero experience though so still I dunno really.
A year or so ago I ran a few numbers and it looked like a guy would have 3 to 4 times as much into upgrades as the cost of the original machine. If you were short on space, it’s still not a bad price for the thing. But I’m reflexively cheap so I felt compelled to pay more upfront so the upgrades wouldn’t “seem” so much like nail soup. Plus the axiom holds: it’s never big enough nor powerful enough.
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First off thank you @vinito and @jamesdhatch for your imput. From what i gather I should go for 60 W and use at a lower wattage to make it last longer. I think thats what i read in a round about way? Sensory Overload. I guess i need to look at prices then look at vidios of each machine in my budget to see If one has something i prefer over a different one. I would prefer to buy one that has what im after in the start. I do not want to buy one that is junk from the start and parts hard to get. Im not worried if i spend up around 2k as long as I know im getting a decent one. It will be hobby use. Like my Crossfires, Just a hobby to lose money on lol.
Not exactly. There’s almost zero difference in running the laser at 95% power vs 5%. But and enormous difference between 98% and 95% (like more than half). Go over and it’s generally a question of months vs years of life.
Most stock cheap lasers are overdriven - 100% or more. A good tube has a label telling the max & rated power. Keep to 95% of the rated & never drive it to the max.
lightobject.com has good tubes and other parts. A good lens is a decent investment too.
Keep your optics clean
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Thank you James. I really am Laser stupid. But it looks fun. I knew nothing about CNC plasma tables not that long ago and now have 2. But then again come to think of it Im CNC plasma table stupid also. Hmm a pattern going here.
Says everyone getting their first laser. Not usually something we’re born knowing
What’s neat is the same designs can usually be used in any of your CNC devices. I actually use the laser to test new plasma designs before I burn through some expensive steel.
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Hey fellow Kansan, I ordered mine it should be here late March.