Impression of customer service?

I don’t know if it matters, but I never received this alert. When I emailed to inquire about the shipping dates (Was expecting june) I was simply told “it will ship end of july” (which is a month later than expected.) and there was no explanation as to why that was the case. When I (I think understandably) asked for more details, those emails were simply ignored. I had sent pictures of the box that came in that appeared to be damaged and that was responded to, but the rest of the email was simply ignored. When I send a second followup that entire email was ignored.

I am not trying to be a pain, and I understand things happen. If this was communicated, I would not have ever had an issue. My issue is with the lack of communication after taking my money. I understand the issues with delays and even looked on the website and forum trying to find this explanation and did not see it before I emailed. This info should be placed on your website in plain view to avoid these situations for future reference.

Thank you for getting back to us on this issue and for the explanation. That is all I was looking for.

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It may also be a good Idea for Langmuir to state this is the best method of communication. Most every company responds to email, not a forum post. This forum post is the first time I received any useful information after emailing several times and is the opposite of how most company’s communicate in my experience.

I think most people have had at least a couple grumbles about the shipping. No doubt it’s a colossal task that I’m glad I personally don’t have to navigate. And, having received and assembled boxes 1 & 2, I gotta say it’s really impressive/clever how they were able to package everything in a way that lends itself to shipping as well as it does. That being said, there are a couple things over the past few months I wasn’t ecstatic about.

I was aware that they were already being hammered by people asking for highly personalized updates. I wanted a clarification so I reached out to Langmuire with a simple question so I could interpret the information myself from what was already out there. So I waited. My message was left on read. I reached out to someone else- message left on read and I wait more. I finally tell them I don’t appreciate getting stiffed and they finally reply with something that didn’t even answer my question, and with some jive about it being missed because DMs on the forum not being the main support channel even though I can clearly see two people up and left me on read. I gave up on trying to find out.

I received a bad Y axis rail last week. I did my due diligence and collected supporting material that it was bad. It was Friday afternoon and I took a long weekend off for it. I go to the main site for support this time, and found that the only phone number was for making an order with their sales department, while technical support was just a form where I couldn’t even provide proof my rail was bad, and I just had to wait until someone got to me. This SERIOUSLY rubbed me the wrong way, but whatever. So I waste all that time waiting and providing the proof instead of addressing the actual issue, and then silence because of the weekend. So in multiple ways, I waste my time and money buying carbide dremel bits to make fix the mis-stamped holes, because taking more time off from the day job would have cost more than the tools to fix it and continue. A massive disappointment after 5 months of waiting without bitching.

I posted pictures of the rail in the forum. Someone from Langmuire replied over the weekend and said they would replace anything that was wrong, but not before making their skepticism that anything was wrong a little too clear. Again, not a huge deal, a little nit picky, but cumulatively these experiences are starting to leave a bad taste in my mouth.

I get that it’s practically a startup. I get it’s a pre-order. I get they are busy. I get COVID is a thing. But any sales guy knows that large purchases are justified financially, but experienced emotionally, and I’m frustrated. So fwiw, this has been my experience with their customer service.

We sent a mass email out to all customers that were part of the June group. Sometimes our emails get caught in the Spam or promotional tabs unfortunately depending on which email provider you use.

I’m seeing your email about the hole spacings on the Y axis rail in our system and that we responded to it on Friday. Our response was to send us pictures and that we would evaluate what would need to be sent as a replacement. We received your response to that at the end of our work day before the weekend which is why it wasn’t responded to immediately. Based on the picture you sent it is very clear that the holes are not properly located and that we owe you a new Y axis rail tube. Would you still like us to send it under warranty?

I could not have said it better, I think everyone understands all of these things, but it seems it is expected that the customers are to be understanding of any issue and not expect decent customer service. My last email was 6 days ago and I still don’t have a response (which is what prompted this post) Any business that forgets about their customers once they have received payment or flat out ignores them will not last very long. You take care of your customers and they will keep coming back and recommend you to their peers. I can not say I would recommend this company and I don’t even have a product to review yet. I will be doing a review on youtube once I get my table and this will definitely be part of that review. People need to know what they are stepping into when ordering something from Langmuir. Obviously keeping their shipping dates and communicating with customers is a huge problem that they don’t seem to be in a hurry to rectify.

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Right- I never faulted anyone for not responding after the weekend started, or even immediately after the weekend. I understand things get piled up and addressed on Mondays. My intention was just to give an insight into my experience on the consumer end, should you guys choose to use it constructively. I didn’t care enough to share all these details when they’d initially happened but it seemed appropriate here.

As for the Y rail, I suppose I wouldn’t mind it if you wouldn’t mind sending it- the time and money has already been sunk. I’m as far into assembly as I can get without the water table but I would hate to be down the road only to find out the rail is causing problems and I’m stuck without one. So sure I guess

I can see that happening, I did IT support for years. What I don’t understand is the lack of response to the rest of the post. Something along the lines of:

We are reviewing this shortcoming and are implementing new training / policy on how to handle this type of communication, Going forward, we will make sure all emails and the entire email is replied to, regardless of how uncomfortable the answer may be on our part.

We all Understand there are growing pains in starting any business, but ignoring your customers is not a good practice and is disrespectful to those that trusted you with thousands of dollars. You are marketing to mostly DIY/ personal / non business customers. This was not a line item on an expense report, this was a major investment that I saved up for over months. I had plans to build things and had friends of mine waiting on “June, no July, oh well, the end of July, and probably august now” and had to shelf alot of stuff and pay for parts to be made that should have been made in my own shop. You stated a delivery date and severely missed that date. You should at least understand how disappointing that is to your customers and how we took you at your word and you have let us down. But the impression I get it an attitude of “oh well, you just have to wait” , “we are shipping as fast as we can, you just need to be patient”

I deal with unrealistic expectations from my customers daily. (I do not think that our expectations are unrealistic) There are times that you simply cannot deliver what you were expecting to deliver. That is the point that communication and being willing to eat the crow served to you becomes of vital importance to your relationship to your customers. This seems to be severely lacking here. It is surprising that that is not obvious to langmuir.

I am upset because of the lack of response up to this point, I am frustrated that I am still waiting on something I spent a substantial amount of money on several months ago that still has no sign of being here this month. I am not trying to be offensive and have tried my best to be patient up to the point that my requests were simply ignored (For days). Please understand that this rant/thread is a direct result of that frustration and lack of communication. I hope you guys get this stuff Ironed out and your business prospers. When I see someone do right by their customers, I am the first to herald it to as many people as I can. The same is true when the opposite is happens.

All that being said, Thank you for offering a mostly affordable CNC plasma table to people like me. I love building stuff, and this will open up possibilities that I never thought I could do at home. It may even allow me to get some sort of return on my investment down the road and I am very excited about that prospect. I am sure all of the kinks will eventually get worked out. I cant express just how excited I am to start turning out parts at home and am looking forward to getting my table and setting it up.

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If I were going to visit another country, it would be Australia, but I like being home in my shop too much to travel too far, I fear I am becoming a hermit :slight_smile:

Those shipping charges are beyond painful, is that normal for other things ordered online? I vote they move you up in the shipping que, You paid quite the price to get your table! I guess I don’t have as much to complain about! I hope you get your table soon.

I know that I can only speak from my experience but I have called at least twice (left messages) and then emailed twice and all 4 of these were responded to via email within a business day. I know daniel mentioned it but have you verified that your email in their system is correct and that you are not sending these items to spam/junk etc?

It seems very odd that you did not get the mass email either since it was kind of a big deal on the forum when it came out. Finally, have you looked over the Batch 2 Shipping forum post? It has an excel sheet and you can see/follow tracking of others around your purchase date/purchase number.

I know customer service is a huge thing for me too. Sorry this has been such a bummer.

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I will say that when I have called about other issues or asking questions, I did get a quick response. To be honest, this added to my frustration when emailing what should have been a simple question and getting ignored.

I have not, but I have been receiving emails from them for other things, and none of those have gone to spam.

I only really looked at the forum to find what people were doing once they got their machine to improve it. I tried to forget about my order until June so I didn’t die of anticipation :stuck_out_tongue: so it was not something I really looked at until mid July rolled around and still no table. And I would have thought an email to them would have been replied to with all of that information ( we sent a mass email, here are some things to look at, this is the reason we missed our ship date, sorry for the delay etc… )

I’ll look for that, didn’t know about it, thank you for bringing that to my attention.

I have always worked with customers, and have found that your customer service will make a break a business. Without exception a business without good customer service always goes under (unless you are a monopoly or government funded) I would think this would be a huge deal for a small business just getting their products out to their customers.

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Any of you guys ever order a new vehicle? I have, and 2 years ago my $60k truck was multiple months late, with terrible communication, from an enormous international automotive company.

Methinks expectations are a bit high for a company selling a consumer grade CNC table that is as high on the value scale as anything else on the market. Throw covid into the mix and I dare say that even a company that has good communication and service is going to struggle to provide the same level of service and speed of delivery as usual. Try to have some patience and just be glad they didn’t go belly up and take your money with them.

If you expect to build a business, or expect professional grade service, there are plenty of companies selling less machine for more money, the same(ish) machine for lots more money, or a bigger machine for real big business money that you can choose from.

Don’t give up hope for the best service in the world, but try to keep your expectations reasonable for what you’re actually buying.

If you want, I’ll be happy to share stories about $250k CNC benders and million dollar tube lasers and some of the “excellent” service they’ll overcharge you for.

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I think not being completely ignored by someone that took my money to be plenty reasonable. Communication was all I asked for. I finally got it today and am happy to have done so.

I work for a small business, We cannot afford to ignore our customers or we will not exist as a company. That should be fairly obvious.

A return email is too high of an expectation?

Well I wouldn’t know that as I have yet to receive mine.

They sold a table, I paid for it, All I asked for was answers, I didn’t expect anything free, I didn’t ask for money back, I asked for an honest update and what to expect going forward seeing as how we were two months past June. I didn’t even start complaining until They refused to answer simple questions. I followed through with my end of the deal and paid them the money asked for happily, They did not follow through on their delivery date, I asked for information because if this… how is that unreasonable?

I’ve seen plenty of money wasted on all kinds of things, but this is my money, I am not a business with and infinite budget.

To Clarify,

I only took this to the forum AFTER several attempts via email and 6 days of being ignored. I never expected anything other than what I paid for. This expectation was not met, so I asked for updates only to have vague conflicting information sent back and completely ignoring the majority of the questions. After waiting Days for a response after waiting a month more than the ship date patiently assuming something happened and set them back (Covid maybe) I reached out for a simple update. When it became obvious they didn’t care, I decided to find another approach (Hence this forum post) I don’t like to be the squeaky wheel, but after getting no other information, that was the only approach left to me.

Either way, The issue is settled at this point and I got the answers I was looking for. I honestly don’t see how I was being unreasonable , unrealistic, or rude. A simple email with accurate information and a little understanding could have avoided this much easier. I never yelled, I never called anyone names, I simply stated a problem and asked for a resolution, after the information was received, I offered some constructive criticism in the hopes that it may help a future customer avoid this and Langmuir to do well as a company going forward, I discussed the situation with other people on the forum, I am still not seeing the unrealistic expectation on my part?

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Hi @MrHaNkBoT I have to respectfully disagree mate. Regardless of what the product is or the value of the product customer services very important. $10 to me might be worth $2000 to someone else. If you are in business to on-sell products or manufacture from new, Producing an amazing product (like the Langmuir table) is half the job. I don’t think anything mentioned in this thread is anything but constructive for Langmuir and maybe a hard pill to swallow at first but I have no doubt that this will turn them into a very strong business. I can’t imagine how frustrating it would be for them to recieve countless emails about “where is my product” but Langmuir needs to put themselves in the customers shoes. In my case at least,close to $5000 AUD spent. My purchase has definitely not a been as bad as others and in fact my 2nd order for the machine torch holder,height control unit and CPC cable was shipped and received in Australia in 2 weeks. Maybe i just got lucky with timming but thats amazing service !! Hats off to Langmuir systems. Thank you to all for what I think has been a very constructive thread.

@keithwhite Don’t misunderstand my reply as trying to say they did nothing wrong or that the expectation of communication from a company is completely unreasonable, they absolutely should have gotten back to you in response to your email, and answered whatever questions you had that they had answers for and explained why they couldn’t answer the rest. To use your line “maybe covid”; maybe their suppliers have been stringing them along too and they didn’t have any concrete information to offer you, thus vague responses to your questions, though you could have asked over the phone as you said they were answering their phones. Again, not saying you should have to call them when you have already emailed them, just that you could have. The easiest way for them to have handled it as soon as they started falling behind on deliveries would have been to update the lead times on their website so people had a better idea of what was going on, and how much of a delay they might expect.

You can call it wasted money on industrial grade machines and their associated costs, but those benders and tube lasers make money, and customers don’t want excuses, they want their parts on time. No business has an infinite budget.

Also, playing devils advocate, you absolutely can ignore your customers as a small business if you have a desirable enough product in a niche market. The risk you run is that someone else will produce the same product at similar prices and better service and your customers will have somewhere else to go. Hell, Sprint and Spectrum prove you can ignore and mistreat your customers as a large business too. :rofl:

I hope they ship your machine soon, and that your feedback has improved their responsiveness to email.

@Smurfos Disagreement is good, arguing is bad, let’s disagree for a bit. I wasn’t saying they can’t do better, or that they shouldn’t strive to not let anyone fall through the cracks, but rather that the expectation that they are going to be as or more responsive and communicative than multi million or billion dollar companies might not necessarily be a realistic expectation. Do I hope that every company I do business with is going to knock it out of the park, of course, but I always remember the design triangle and try to apply it to the situation; good, cheap, or fast, pick 2. In this case fast is also representing communication/lead time. By all accounts the machine is cheap, and very good for the money, that means the cost savings came from the third leg of the triangle.

How would you feel if your $1,500,000 tube laser went down for 4 weeks while techs from Rofin and BLM charged $60,000 to find a dodgy $25 laser power override control switch on the main control panel? How about waiting 4 days to get a reply from a company that sold you a $120,000 CNC tube roller when it won’t program a part correctly? Or much more personal to me, spending $11k on a CNC mill for my garage that was supposed to take 6 weeks to deliver that took 5 months. I pissed off and lost the customer I bought the machine to make parts for thanks to that, and it’s why I won’t promise any parts to ANYONE till I not only have the machine, but have used it enough to trust it. I’ll tell you now, the CNC mill pissed me off more because it was my money, but the other machines were a way bigger deal, the tube laser lost as much money in missed production every 2 days being down, as my CNC mill cost.

I know $1500-3000 is a lot of money, but it’s not THAT much money or none of us would have had the disposable income to spare. Remember this is a consumer grade product aimed at hobby shops, and AT MOST budding businesses or custom fab shops. I’ll warn everyone right now that if you plan to build a plasma cutting business around a machine of this grade it better be mostly for your own products or flexible customers, this is not, I repeat, NOT an industrial grade machine.

I’d put some more time and effort into further clarifying what I’m trying to say, but I’m on vacation and the lake is calling. Just understand that I’m not trying to belittle your experience, just trying to help you temper expectations for what to expect as you start buying CNC/industrial equipment, it’s not going to get all that much better as you buy more and more expensive machines. Good luck to all.

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Just FYI - Box 2 of three shipped yesterday evening.

Just to verify, I ordered the THC on a separate order, (Order #15067) Will this come with one of the three boxes or will it arrive separately?

Separately if like everyone else.

I don’t think I would feel all that great. I understand what you are saying. Thankyou for the chat. Enjoy the lake buddy

Hello Keith, I am new to Langmuir and haven’t used the forum before. I was waiting for my table too! I kept in contact with customer service but not enough to bother them. I always received a response from them. They told me that they were having trouble getting certain parts because of the Covid thing and it would take about another 2 to 3 weeks. So it was! I received the first box and a 2 weeks later I received the second . Your right, I do not know your situation but try again and be patient. I have read about a lot of complaints. Just as in life everyone has problems. Good luck, hope you get the second box soon… be safe!